Magi Mike's Blog

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Did Christ Expect Judgement Day 2000 Years Ago?

with 9 comments


Jerry Newcombe of Coral Ministries, a TV God Channel, is a frequent guest commentator on The Christian Post blog. We have to admire him for taking the rise out of Harold Camping’s prophesy that the Judgement Day is nigh, on 21 May as a matter of fact. So hurry, you Christians, repent! The admiration is because Camping is another TV Christian pundit, and it is unusual, but pleasant to see the somewhat more serious Christians critizing the lunatic fringe of Christianity. The article is amusingly titled:

Do I think Judgment Day is coming on May 21? Well, let’s talk it over on May 22.

It raises something more important than whether God allows mortal men to know when He has planned Judgement Day to be. It is whether Christ himself prophesied the Judgement, and, if so, when. Naturally Christians say he did not make any such prophesy, but wait:

When ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors. This generation shall not pass, till all these things be done. Heaven and earth shall pass away. But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father. Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.

This is extracted from Mark 13:29-33. Sure enough no one except God the Father knows when the time of the End of the World will be. Not even the Son knows the time. But Jesus knows the people he is addressing will see it. So, he is actually prophesying the end of the world during that generation—the generation of the audience before him.

A Jewish generation is 40 years, but even if he meant it to be the lifetime of those present, it has certainly passed now, 2000 years later. And the world is still with us! In fact, no student of the gospels could fail to notice that Christ was obviously waiting for the angelic host in the Garden of Gethsemane, though it has been edited out, except for a reference to angels. He did not know when the angels would burst forth from the Mount of Olives, but he had come to believe it would be during that Passover. At dawn, he realized he was mistaken and resigned himself to dying as a false prophet, as the law of Deuteronomy specified.

The Christianity pages on the AskWhy! main website treats it all more fully.

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Written by mikemagee

18 May, 2011 at 10:09 pm

9 Responses

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  1. Judgment day announced by Jesus will surely come. People who are privileged to stand on the right side will enjoy the eternal bliss in heaven.Where will be your place? right or left?

    A.Yeshuratnam

    17 July, 2011 at 3:28 pm

  2. Why are you so sure, since the Son of God Himself got his announcement wrong? Neither he nor you have any clue about Judgement Day, what it means, if anything, and when it will come, other than what Christians have told you, and all they knew was what Christians had told them, and so on. You are all suckers for a preposterous temporal chain letter, like the ones you get on the internet. You have to pass the message on or you will get terribly bad luck, like suffering horribly when you are judged! If it helps to stop you from being a criminal, then maybe it has some value, but neither professed Christians nor professed Moslems have any reputation for being particularly good people throughout history. It does not work too well.

    Mike Magee

    17 July, 2011 at 6:49 pm

    • You are in error.

      Matt 23:36 “Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.”

      In Matt 23:36, there is no Hypothetical. Matt 23:34-35 can be ascribed to history, i.e. that generation.

      Matt 23:39 “For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, TILL (Gr. heos an) ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.”

      In Matt 23:39, the word “till”, but specifically (Gr.) heos an, carries a strong Hypothetical force. The verse may be worded in this manner:

      “IF ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord, THEN ye shall see Me henceforth.”

      The if-then Conditional provided by the Hypothetical may be symbolized thusly:

      P -> Q

      If P, then Q

      This is the same phraseology used in Matt 24:34, Mark 13:30, and Luke 21:32.

      Matt 24:34 “Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, TILL (Gr. heos an) all these things be fulfilled.”

      The verse(s) may be worded in this manner:

      “IF all these things be fulfilled, THEN this generation shall pass.”

      P -> Q

      If we say, “But all of those things were not fulfilled, therefore their generation should not have passed”, that is a Fallacy of Reasoning called Denying the Antecedent.

      If we say, “But their generation did pass, therefore all those things should have been fulfilled”, that is a Fallacy of Reasoning called Affirming the Consequent.

      Don’t quote the Apostles. Their knowledge of the times and seasons was NOT sequitur.Act 1:7

      phillip

      15 September, 2012 at 1:03 pm

      • The apostles can have known no more about the end of the world than anyone else, but they were declared to be witnesses till the “end of the earth” (Acts 1:8), not a long time admittedly because Christ had arisen along with the dead saints who were walking around Jerusalem.

        But you are in error, deliberately, I should imagine. Mark 13:30 does not use “heos an” but “mechris”, so the sophistry introduced by Matthew and Luke is invalid in Mark, the earliest gospel. Matthew and Luke were attempting to correct the “errors” of Mark. 40 years had passed, and there was no sign of the second coming, whence the sophistry. In any case, the pure conditional is not an alternative to the construction used. The “an” adds a touch of doubt as we might use “perhaps” or “maybe”, and that is shown by other passages where it is hard to squeeze any sense out of casting the sentence into your purely conditional form.

        So the later evangelists were simply leaving a loophole for the facts occurring in a way that Christ had not prophesied. In a similar way, they added a loophole for rich Romans to get through the eye of a needle, all things being possible with God.

        Jesus was expecting the end of the age, and his disciples believed his resurrection heralded it. As it did not happen immediately, they invented the second coming, but by the time that Matthew and Luke were writing, they were having to explain away that too.

        Mike Magee

        15 September, 2012 at 3:23 pm

      • “But you are in error, deliberately, I should imagine.”

        To declare that a person is in error is one thing.

        But to declare that your imagination has caused you to see my motives is a Non Sequitur. That is not Sound Reasoning. You will refrain from this.

        In Acts 1:8 “earth”, (Gr) ge, is used of soil, land, region, earth, and of a country as distinct from other countries, E.g.:

        “the land of JUDA” Matt 2:6

        “the land of ISRAEL” Matt 2:20, etc.

        “Ye shall not have gone over the cities of ISRAEL, TILL (Gr heos an) the Son of man be come.” Matt 10:23

        IF the Son of Man come (P), THEN ye shall have gone over the cities of ISRAEL. (Q)

        P -> Q

        If they do preach over the cities of ISRAEL (Q), wherever they are scattered (Deu 32:26), may we conclude that the Son of Man has come (P)? I tro not.

        Therefore, Peter gave the another CONDITION to ISRAEL in Acts 3:12-26, as in Mat 23:39.

        “Ye men of ISRAEL…” Acts 3:12 “repent…and and He shall send Jesus Christ”. Act 3:19-20.

        God has not sent Jesus Christ. Therefore, ISRAEL has not repented. Acts 4:1-21; 5:40-42; 7:57-60; 28.

        But when the remnant are affrighted and give “glory to the God of heaven”, THEN the “seventh angel” will sound. Rev 11:13-15.

        Have I made an error with Mark 13:30? Oh, dear. I did so want it to be perfect.

        Nevertheless, I shall not take one population of the text to draw such a hasty conclusion in light of the aforementioned conditionals.

        302. Gr “an”: a primary particle, denoting a supposition, wish, possibility or uncertainty. Usually unexpressed except by the subjunctive or potential mood. Also contracted for 1437

        1437 ean eh-an’ from 1487 and 302; a conditional particle; in case that, provided, etc.; often used in connection with other particles to denote indefiniteness or uncertainty

        Your third and fourth paragraphs are pure supposition, and therefore unimportant.

        phillip

        16 September, 2012 at 4:49 am

      • Why do I listen to people who make invalid statements?

        My error was slight.

        Mark 13:30 says “till all ‘of which’ 3739 these things be done.”

        Concordant Literal Version: “the time when all these things MAY be occurring.”

        Not “should be” as in Matt 24:34 and Luke 21:32. CLV

        I will offer MY Non Sequitur…

        This is the first time you have been met with a Logical Argument from a “theist”… quite POSSIBLY for the first time in your miserable existence.

        Therefore, you are hasty to invalidate me, even if it means a forfeiture of your logic.

        phillip

        16 September, 2012 at 5:38 am

    • It is not my imagination that sees your error as deliberate but my reason. Your picking over the Greek to get the sense you want is evidently to impress the reader of your scholarship, but a scholar could not have made the error you did inadvertently. If you maintain it was inadvertent, you are not a scholar. When you cannot make the Greek itself match your fancy, you choose a different version that almost does.

      Having complained about my questioning of your scholarly honesty, you end up proving that you are thoroughly obnoxious.

      Mike Magee

      16 September, 2012 at 2:22 pm

  3. Did not the Son of Man sit at the right hand of God? So what He prdeicted is correct. G.K.Chesterton tells the story of an English sailor who miscalculated his course and thought he’d discovered a new land in the South Seas. Ready to plant the British flag and claim the land as New South Wales, he’d actually landed back in his homeland. In search of new, he had discovered the old. Some of us are in a ‘distant country’ today. We’ve wandered far from our spiritual home. Christan wayfarers know that the goal of life’s journey is nothing less than heaven. The grand story that begins in a garden ends in a magnificiient city.

    A.Yeshuratnam

    23 July, 2011 at 6:56 pm

  4. Evidently you believe he did sit at the right hand of God, as several Christians books say, but why should I or anyone else have to believe it, whatever it means. I have no way of verifying it, but every one of us living since Christ made his erroneous prophecy testifies to its falseness, and the report of the prophecy in Mark tells us, for what it is worth, that the Son did not know when the world would end, yet he boasted knew it would end in the lifetime of the generation he addressed. It seems he was stepping beyond his competence in making this prophecy. Deuteronomy says false prophets must die, and Lo! he died! Your little parable and its explanation are entertaining, but the message has a distinctly Gnostic tinge that many modern Christians might reject. Christians have for 2000 years been prophecying that Christ’s false prophecy would be true “soon”. Just how “soon” is “soon”? It might be more helpful to make that prophecy.

    mikemagee

    19 August, 2011 at 7:55 pm


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